To Perv or not to Perv ...?
Aug. 18th, 2007 11:36 am![[personal profile]](https://www.dreamwidth.org/img/silk/identity/user.png){kind=small}
essayelI saw this article posted on ![[livejournal.com profile]](https://www.dreamwidth.org/img/external/lj-userinfo.gif)
gaycrows journal. To save you reading it, the author describes how disturbed and revolted he is by the fan fiction written by women as old as 50+ [how shocking] about Harry Potter and how these 'pedophiles' [the spelling doesn't look correct to me but I use a different dctionary] lust over poor Dan Radcliffe, using him, as Harry, as a masturbatory fantasy. Naturally he's flamed to dust in the comments, which are also interesting reading.
On one level I felt a certain sympathy - because I've seen fics that made me blench and hit the back button so fast I almost broke my finger. They could really disturb a sensitive young chap if he had really looked hard enough to find them.
But I wonder how he managed to find out the ages of the writers so accurately, one can only presume that he cherrypicked for age and incompetence AND 'perviness' [his pitch not mine], so that he could be suitably outraged. Sadly, he says he thinks ALL fanfic is wrong, which rather takes his protestation of not being biased out of the frame since he won't have been the least bit sympathetic even to the excellently written and paced and plotted stories that we know are out there. In fact I'm betting he didn't bother to read anything that didn't have an NC-17 rating and a PWP tag. Oddly enough, as far as fan fic went, he seemed more bothered about het shipping than slash which he barely mentioned.
Is it possible, do you think, to write a half way decent and accurate depiction of teen age life - and especially one set in the torrid hormone heavy world of a mixed-sex boarding school - that DOESN'T have sex in it? I remember being 14 and it did rather prey on my mind.
Then there was his attitude to older women in general. He kept saying 'oh I only mean 'some' but then quoting the many elderly perverts he counts as friends who would love to give Dan/Harry one. This sounded to me the sort of thing women say in a bunch to amuse each other and especially if they know they are going to weird a bloke out by saying it. Also, if he feels that they are pedophiles [his spelling again] why is he friendly with them - or does he smile to their faces and rush off to write about them behind their backs? Hmm, think I know the answer to that one.
Shock horror - some women went to see Equus because Dan Radcliffe was nude in it!! Er - well - he DID rather make a spectacle of himself in the advertising material. I'm sure people went to see it who were quite gobsmacked as the play progressed. {Many years ago I learned and rehearsed the part of the 'girlfriend' but we couldn't get permission to perform because of the nudity - ahhh the seventies! - but believe me, by the time the kit comes off the story is such that you barely notice, there's so much else on your mind]. He particularly singled out for criticism a mother and daughter who had gone together to see the play and told someone - not him I presume since he's t'other side of the pond - that they were looking forward to seeing Dan's bottom. It seemed to really bother him that 'some women' might be looking at this young man and thinking 'phwoooaaar'. Again he said 'some' women but it didn't ring true. Young ones are okay, old ones aren't.
This is SO UNFAIR! We have eyes. What's the cut off date for looking at someone and thinking 'hey, he/she's nice'? Just looking, you know. Not pouncing on and wrestling the the ground or anything. Presumably there must be one.
Possibly he's one of those people who find the idea of older women having an interest in sex disturbing. You find the same effect with some men who are repulsed by the idea of - um - shall we say plus size? girls having a libido. It throws them into a panic that RL doesn't conform to Hollywood standards.
In the comments he justified himself by saying that it was an opinion piece, clearly labelled as such, and if people didn't agree with his opinion then tough. Right on pal. Good for you. If you have a sincerely held opinion you should stick to it. Yes, I can believe that there are 'some women' who are pushing over the borders of fandom into something more sinister, just as there are 'some men'. But that wasn't the only message I got.
I think the message is that 'older women' a] shouldn't fantasise at all, b] and certainly not about younger men because just eww c] because old women are past it and should be interested in - oh - cats and knitting and baby sitting their grandchildren and keeping out of sight in case young people see them and get scared and d] if they write at all it should be nice fluffy romances where people yearn but keep their kit on like dear old Barbara Cartland used to write or better still self help guides on how to cope with the menopause - NICE things - you know - stuff you could show the vicar.
Yeah, right.
gaycrows journal. To save you reading it, the author describes how disturbed and revolted he is by the fan fiction written by women as old as 50+ [how shocking] about Harry Potter and how these 'pedophiles' [the spelling doesn't look correct to me but I use a different dctionary] lust over poor Dan Radcliffe, using him, as Harry, as a masturbatory fantasy. Naturally he's flamed to dust in the comments, which are also interesting reading.On one level I felt a certain sympathy - because I've seen fics that made me blench and hit the back button so fast I almost broke my finger. They could really disturb a sensitive young chap if he had really looked hard enough to find them.
But I wonder how he managed to find out the ages of the writers so accurately, one can only presume that he cherrypicked for age and incompetence AND 'perviness' [his pitch not mine], so that he could be suitably outraged. Sadly, he says he thinks ALL fanfic is wrong, which rather takes his protestation of not being biased out of the frame since he won't have been the least bit sympathetic even to the excellently written and paced and plotted stories that we know are out there. In fact I'm betting he didn't bother to read anything that didn't have an NC-17 rating and a PWP tag. Oddly enough, as far as fan fic went, he seemed more bothered about het shipping than slash which he barely mentioned.
Is it possible, do you think, to write a half way decent and accurate depiction of teen age life - and especially one set in the torrid hormone heavy world of a mixed-sex boarding school - that DOESN'T have sex in it? I remember being 14 and it did rather prey on my mind.
Then there was his attitude to older women in general. He kept saying 'oh I only mean 'some' but then quoting the many elderly perverts he counts as friends who would love to give Dan/Harry one. This sounded to me the sort of thing women say in a bunch to amuse each other and especially if they know they are going to weird a bloke out by saying it. Also, if he feels that they are pedophiles [his spelling again] why is he friendly with them - or does he smile to their faces and rush off to write about them behind their backs? Hmm, think I know the answer to that one.
Shock horror - some women went to see Equus because Dan Radcliffe was nude in it!! Er - well - he DID rather make a spectacle of himself in the advertising material. I'm sure people went to see it who were quite gobsmacked as the play progressed. {Many years ago I learned and rehearsed the part of the 'girlfriend' but we couldn't get permission to perform because of the nudity - ahhh the seventies! - but believe me, by the time the kit comes off the story is such that you barely notice, there's so much else on your mind]. He particularly singled out for criticism a mother and daughter who had gone together to see the play and told someone - not him I presume since he's t'other side of the pond - that they were looking forward to seeing Dan's bottom. It seemed to really bother him that 'some women' might be looking at this young man and thinking 'phwoooaaar'. Again he said 'some' women but it didn't ring true. Young ones are okay, old ones aren't.
This is SO UNFAIR! We have eyes. What's the cut off date for looking at someone and thinking 'hey, he/she's nice'? Just looking, you know. Not pouncing on and wrestling the the ground or anything. Presumably there must be one.
Possibly he's one of those people who find the idea of older women having an interest in sex disturbing. You find the same effect with some men who are repulsed by the idea of - um - shall we say plus size? girls having a libido. It throws them into a panic that RL doesn't conform to Hollywood standards.
In the comments he justified himself by saying that it was an opinion piece, clearly labelled as such, and if people didn't agree with his opinion then tough. Right on pal. Good for you. If you have a sincerely held opinion you should stick to it. Yes, I can believe that there are 'some women' who are pushing over the borders of fandom into something more sinister, just as there are 'some men'. But that wasn't the only message I got.
I think the message is that 'older women' a] shouldn't fantasise at all, b] and certainly not about younger men because just eww c] because old women are past it and should be interested in - oh - cats and knitting and baby sitting their grandchildren and keeping out of sight in case young people see them and get scared and d] if they write at all it should be nice fluffy romances where people yearn but keep their kit on like dear old Barbara Cartland used to write or better still self help guides on how to cope with the menopause - NICE things - you know - stuff you could show the vicar.
Yeah, right.
![[identity profile]](https://www.dreamwidth.org/img/silk/identity/openid.png){kind=small}
(no subject)
Date: 2007-08-18 12:52 pm (UTC)Of COURSE the over-forties are going to write fan fic. We invented it back in the sixties. College roneo machines all over the Western world were used to churn out fanzines with torrid stories concerning Her Loveliness Mary Sue saving the day while Kirk and Spock humped in the background. He's lucky he's looking now.
Sadly the GOOD stuff doesn't make a good story.
(no subject)
Date: 2007-08-18 03:07 pm (UTC)Interesting that there's no mention of all of the young girls out there lusting over the older men in the stories...I guess that's okay with him?
It's hard to take anyone like this seriously.
(no subject)
Date: 2007-08-18 04:25 pm (UTC)Although if we flipped it around and had 30,40,50-something guys drooling and writing fic about teenaged girls...
Oh wait. That's de rigeur for established pop culture in America. *wry*
(no subject)
Date: 2007-08-18 05:29 pm (UTC)(no subject)
Date: 2007-08-18 11:57 pm (UTC)Did you notice the comment by Ashtyn? That's his partner ... I took particular offence at her words.
(no subject)
Date: 2007-08-19 01:32 am (UTC)http://www.journalfen.net/community/fandom_wank/1104917.html?page=1#comments
(no subject)
Date: 2007-08-20 07:35 am (UTC)Some men get very uncomfortable with the thought that women are sexual creatures not just to please men. That they have fantasies or talk about men the way men talk about women, mutatis mutandis. Also, it is quite inconceivable that women enjoy the thought of two blokes together just like men can endlessly watch 'hot lesbian action' in commercial pr0n movies. Poor little Dominick didn't even go there - he'd die of fright.
My god, that little guy is so fifties! I mean, we don't go 'UGH!!!' endlessly at the thought that some beer-gutted 'dirty old man' drools over suggestive pics of pretty young actresses. Remember the Anna Kournikova virus years ago? When millions of computers got infected because that early email virus promised revealing pictures of a pretty Russian tennis players? Everybody found it amusing but entirely natural that millions of male users clicked that. Same difference.
(no subject)
Date: 2007-08-20 08:55 pm (UTC)You have to admire the way he fight's his corner, though. He actually turned up on someone's LJ to defend his article.
(no subject)
Date: 2007-08-20 09:06 pm (UTC)When you consider that the average age of top models is 15 to 22 and the younger she is when she starts the better chance she has of getting photographic work, that must mean that an awful lot of men who in NO WAY should be condsidered pedophiles, spend time admiring very young girls.
(no subject)
Date: 2007-08-20 09:07 pm (UTC)And yeah, poor dab. Scared of the nasty old women.
(no subject)
Date: 2007-08-20 09:09 pm (UTC)And that deeply offensive young woman, Ashtyn [sounds like a metal receptacle for cigarette butts] got in on the act with a follow up article about how Harry Potter fans are illiterate, unintelligent morons and all the creative intellectual people she knows HATE the books as much as she does.
(no subject)
Date: 2007-08-20 09:12 pm (UTC)Well actually it wouldn't do anything to me. Other than be marked as spam. Seen one seen 'em all.
(no subject)
Date: 2007-08-20 09:19 pm (UTC)(no subject)
Date: 2007-08-20 10:13 pm (UTC)(no subject)
Date: 2007-08-20 10:15 pm (UTC)(no subject)
Date: 2007-08-20 10:18 pm (UTC)(no subject)
Date: 2007-08-20 11:56 pm (UTC)Well they are one and the same man - Robert Winder. I don't think he counts twice, do you?
(no subject)
Date: 2007-08-21 12:00 am (UTC)(no subject)
Date: 2007-08-21 06:32 pm (UTC)(no subject)
Date: 2007-08-22 07:51 am (UTC)She's written another provocative article.
Here (http://www.literaryillusions.com/LIreviews/2007/08/21/jk-rowling-harry-potter-adult-fan-fiction/#more-717).
This woman's an attention seeking ... person! :D